On the other hand, Wang Wook, Yeon-hwa and his mother wouldnt be exiled nor harmed by Wang So. This Lady Oh, similar to the Lady Oh in the Korean Drama, also had a humble background and was King Taejos first love. WANG YO WOULD DIE AND WANG SO WOULD BE GWANGJONG. Check out some goofy behind-the-scenes peeks here! The 2022 December K-drama, The Forbidden Marriage, will be an easy watch as its historical romance storyline packs a punch. To stop the uproar in the palace, their mother forces Dam-yi to give up who she is and pose as the prince. As mentioned earlier, he married Yeon-hwa. Lady Hae had asked Wook to either take a second wife or divorce . some goofy behind-the-scenes peeks here! One-ninth of the wildly successful boyband, EXO, Baek Hyun has established himself as a soulful crooner and has appeared in several variety shows alongside his fellow band members. Wang Wook, later on realized his true feelings for her but he can't say it because she's already gone. Hae Su (Lee Ji Eun) might get engaged with Prince Wang Wook (Kang Ha Neul) in "Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo" episode 5. . . . Its only a matter of time so Im preparing myself for that exact moment. But later on, she starts to fall for the intimidating 4th prince Wang So (Lee Joon Gi), who hides his face behind a mask and is given the derogatory label, "wolf dog." Staying in Songak: Directed by Kyoo-tae Kim. In 982, Seongjong adopted the suggestions in a memorial written by Confucian scholar Choe Seung-ro (; ) and began to create a Confucian-style government. Historically speaking, Wang So only had two wives and he doesnt have any children with Princess Gyeonghwagung, probably because he only married her to save her from a bad arranged marriage and to prevent her from becoming a hostage of the Khitan forces. She meets the eight royal princes of the Wang family and the first king of Goryeo. tower cafe sacramento; galley pirate blox fruits. Then, he meets Wook's wife, Hae Soo, and nothing is simple again. The Khitan withdrew and ceded territory to the east of the Yalu River when Goryeo agreed to end its alliance with Song Dynasty. No matter who he made his Queen, he would only have one true wife. A photo posted by Jisoo (@actor_jisoo) on Jun 20, 2016 at 8:11am PDT. So how can we expect history records to reflect it? This may be because at that time in Goryeo, history was written as it was perceived by the person who wrote it. Who knows? She got so frightened that she told Wang Wook to be careful of Wang So and to not stand in his way. There seems to be no blood and his tight grip seemed to indicate that he was in a lot of internal body pain so it may have been a heart attack, stroke, or an organ failure from mercury poisoning that killed him. Okay, I might be watching too much Korean historical drama because I keep thinking these people died because they were killed and not because of illnesses or diseases. However, Wang Ju only had a 6-year reign and died supposedly of disease. '', ", "[ ] JTBC '' ", "Exports of Hallyu-related consumer goods rise 15.2% in H1", "[V Report Plus] Off-screen scenes of 'Scarlet Heart: Ryeo' featuring Lee Joon-gi", " Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo", " Moon Lovers ", "Travel to "Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo" filming sites", "2016 Gaon Album Chart Week 45 (See #12)", "Awkward and unnatural? Her execution might become a huge shock for Hae Soo and this might lead to the breakup of the romance between Wang So and Hae Soo. Despite being a newbie in the acting industry, 23-year-old Kim Ji Soo (better known simply as Ji Soo) has won a legion of hearts with his earnest and boyish charms. Thank you. Yi Hae-won held a coronation ceremony and claimed to be an "empress" on 29 September 2006. They are both Court ladies who control the Damiwon. On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. Over the years, historical K-dramas have had some bonuses like gender-bender love like The Kings Affection. I dont like Wang Yo but I feel that he was a bad person because of his upbringing and his mothers influence. Panoramica: Lady Hae feels as though she has not fulfilled her duties as a wife to Wook. In modern times, Jang Bong-hwan (Choi Jin-hyuk) is a cocky elite chef for the Blue House who runs into trouble. But that is not where her story ends. We all know Wang Yo was the one who ordered Wang Eun and his relatives to be killed and Wang So only performed the dying wish of Wang Eun but none of the people during that time could attest to that. Lady Oh had the same reaction (clutching her stomach) but it was more intense because she had her illness (cancer) for a while. She initially becomes attracted to the eighth prince, Wang Wook, but later falls for the fourth prince, Wang So, when she sees his true personality. Both parties knew that a key factor influencing the negotiations was the heavy pressure being exerted on the Liao state by Song dynasty. Kang Ha Neul (8th Prince Wang Ok) and Park Shi Eun (Lady Hae) 10 year age difference. Required fields are marked *. Weve also seen in one of Hae Soos visions how Wang Yo would die (Episode 6, right after she slashed her wrist to save herself from becoming the kings wife). It seems like years go, when Wang Wook was the perfect example of the ideal 'nice guy' second-lead. As a model-turned-actor, Nam Joo Hyuk is a rising star to be reckoned with, even landing his first lead role in a TV drama shortly after his debut. Park Si Eun: Age 36. She . In 941, she takes on the name Hae Soo and lives a new life. . Portia says: September 21, 2016 at 10:12 PM . Read on to find out why! Too bad Wang Eun realized too late that he actually loves his wife. This onscreen husband and wife are actually a full decade apart in real life! Out of all the remaining princes, only Wang So and Wang Wook want the throne. Eventually, she finds herself caught in the Goryeo Era's palace politics and rivalries. This blog post was done on October 20, 2016. Without giving away the ending, Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo is well-known for being one of the most tragic historical romances. Every image posted in this blog post are just screencaps or promotional materials taken from the internet and are not owned by the blogger. Wang Ju was succeeded by his cousin, Wang Chi, Wooks son because the 2nd and only other son of Wang So died prematurely. These are just speculations so these may or may not happen. Wang Wook, later on realized his true feelings for her but he can't say it because she's already gone. I really feel sorry for him. The Kings Affection is the first K-drama to win an International Emmy. It might not be just Chae-ryung who would be caught but the execution might also include Wang Won and the rest of the people who conspired in Wang Mus murder since shes bound to tell someone who forced her to do it. She mentioned about being emancipated by Wang Wook when she greeted and gave Hae Soo a birthday gift, wherein Hae Soo replied that her transfer to the Damiwon was the best gift she received on her birthday. Since Yeon-hwa is attracted to Wang So (they also have a triangle love affair with Wang Yo) and even asked him to marry her, there is a strong chance that the marriage between Wang So and Yeon-hwa would happen soon. Kang Ha-Neul (Wang Wook) and Kang Han-na (Yeon-hwa) both share the same surname in real life but thats not the only thing they have in common. After the death of his father and his wife, King Sejong begins investigating the serial murders of Jiphyeonjeon scholars in Gyeongbok Palace. It can be noted that Hae Soo didnt reveal to Wang So who she had feelings for and in Episode 14, Wang So even asked her if it was Wang Jung, which meant that he was still clueless that it was Wang Wook who shared the same feeling with Hae Soo in the past. Though it was obscured, it really looks like Wang Yo because of the beard and the shape of his jaw. Prince Wook faces many problems being part of the Royal family, but that doesn't stop him from enjoying the fun moments with his brothers, his ill wife who he cares for but doesn't truly love her, and the lovely . 6.) Kang Haneul plays Eighth Imperial Prince Wang Wook, whose poster says, "Love and power, I hold both in my heart." . Also, it can be noted that Wang So was asked repeatedly regarding what he was willing to sacrifice to gain the throne (by General Park Soo-kyung and Princess Yeon-hwa). Seongjong married a woman of the Silla royal clan. 4.) Initially, she falls in love with the kind and gentle 8th Prince Wang Wook, but she subsequently starts dating the terrifying 4th Prince Wang So, referred to as a "wolf-dog." As the . I havent watched the Chinese version though so Im assuming its the same with the international version because of the need to translate everything. Taejo will do . Please let the blogger know if you wish to take down any of the images shown on this blog. Her parents were half-siblings because it was a common practice for the royals in the early Goryeo Dynasty to marry within the family to keep their . Wang Wook might also implicate Chae-ryung or Wang Won or even both as part of his plans to get closer to the throne or at least throw a monkey wrench at Hae Soo and Wang Sos relationship. Lady Hae knew that Wang Wook was fond of Hae Soo, so before she died, she let go of Wang Wook and said that he should take of her cousin and find another wife. But in a surprise twist, she is transported to the Goryeo Dynasty. On 10 July 2005, Yi Ku named Yi Won to be his heir. 5.) Also, it is already known in the Korean drama that Wang So will also marry Princess Gyeonghwagung (first daughter of Wang Mu) as his second wife. The Plot in Season 2. Set to be his very first historical drama, he will be starring alongside his very own best friend, Ji Soo! As an example, Wang Jung was right there when Wang Eun begged Wang So to kill him yet he was convinced that Wang So was the bad guy. September 6, 2016, 3:40 AM. The series follows her embroilment in palace politics and changing status amidst her . 3), Park Kwi-soon as the Chief Monk of the temple where the tongueless monks reside (Ep. He held you on his chest like a treasure. Wang Wook, who was married to Hae Soo's cousin, becomes a good friend of Ha Jin. Im hoping for that so we can see Wang Eun and Park Soon-duk again in the present time. That goes without saying that Wang Wook gives up on his love for Hae Soo and would not be able to rekindle the romance they had. Wang Wook isn't happy with his loss and goes back to visit Shin Yool to answer her question about why he's been so nice to her, when he gets there, he sees hi younger brother Prince Wang Won . Seongjong quickly mobilized the military and divided his forces into three army groups to take up defensive positions in the northwest. Lady Hae feels as though she has not fulfilled her duties as a wife to Wook. One of his daughters becomes Queen Mundeok, wife of 6th king, Wang Wook son. Son of Wang So (b955-r975-d981) marries older daughter of Wang Wook, they have one son(b980-r997-d1009) who . document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Designed by Elegant Themes | Powered by WordPress, So lets all hope for Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeos. u, hongjonghyun, beakhyun. The story revolves around the royal kingdom where a 21 st century girl, Go-Ha Jin, who is 25 years old suddenly can travel back in time during an eclipse. Plus, he mentioned he was going to Wang Sik Ryeom. Please note that these are just guesses so some of these may not actually happen and these are not actual or official spoilers. to find out why. The letter wasnt actually delivered to Yinzhen because of a misunderstanding between Yinzhen (4th prince) and Yinti (counterpart of Wang Jung). With Lee Joon-Gi, Ji-eun Lee, Kang Ha-neul, Jong-Hyun Hong. I cant seem to find the name of the Prince where Wang Wons character was based on but the closest to his name was Crown Prince Wonjang. But as the K-drama progresses, Bong-hwans and Queen Cheorins personalities intertwine as he begins to develop feelings for the king. Her grandfather was Emperor Taejo Wang of Goryeo. Lets hope we could see the reincarnated version of the couple when Hae Soo goes back to the present time. Which is a pity, because the sisterhood in the C-drama . In the international version, we can see this preview, however in the SBS version, this part of the preview was missing. A photo posted by (@hjonghyun) on Mar 19, 2016 at 1:22am PDT. NCT 127 . That may be the reason why Hae Soo blindly believed that Gwangjong killed his brothers for the throne. Promotional Image for Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo. According to the info, I guess we can . "Your Highness-es! There was a scene wherein Wang Yo asked Wang Jung if he wanted anything aside from the throne. Blood from the Mouth: By her last appearances she starts coughing up blood with increasing frequency. As the clever 3rd prince Wang Yo in Scarlet Heart, his character is described as very ambitious, with a keen eye for the throne. The Red Sleeve displays a tug-of-war between their hearts, their duty to the palace, and each other. where is bob hoover buried; lloyd williams obituary; raelondo wright rae carruth son; que significa una casa sucia; altland house haunted; avengers fanfiction peter intern meets team cap Born January 6, 1980. Fresh off filming for the sixth and final installment in the Resident Evil movie franchise, he quickly returned to South Korea to assume his role as the 4th prince Wang So in early 2016. CHAE-RYUNG WILL BE CAUGHT & THIS MIGHT CAUSE WANG SO & HAE SOOs BREAK UP. I really pity him because once he was no longer of any use to his mother, she asked him to turn over the throne to Wang Jung. Vostfr tv serie streaming en francais Moon Lovers Scarlet Heart Ryeo Saison 1 pisode 4 +. Kang Hanna as Princess Hwangbo Yeon-hwa. Im thinking that theres a high possibility that Yeon-hwa (or even Wang Wook himself) might also use Wang Wooks previous relationship with Hae Soo to ensure that Wang So agrees to marry her. Pangeran ke-4 Wang So, tokoh utama dalam serial ini, diperankan oleh aktor Lee Joon Ki. In the face of such quick and determined resistance, the Khitan decided that further attempts to conquer the entire peninsula would be far too costly, and sought instead to negotiate a settlement with Goryeo. Ashraf Khater. Even if all Wang So did was grant his dying brothers final wish, he was viewed in a different light by others. Beta: Krysyuy. He married Queen Seonui, 2nd daughter of Queen Jeongdeok (King Taejos consort) and possibly, Wang Wons sister. Di serilanya, Wang Mu diceritakan diracun oleh komplotan Wang Yo, yaitu pangeran ke-9 Wang Won dan pangeran ke-8 Wang Wook. Based on Goryeo history, Wang So lived until he was 51 years old and died supposedly of illness. Baek Hee Sung conceals his identity and past from his wife Cha Ji Won. This performance earned him a "Excellence Award" at the 2016 SBS Drama Awards. In an effort to calm the court nobility, minister Seo Hui volunteered to negotiate directly with General Xiao. The lead is both male and female. She awakens in the body of Hae Soo, one of the numerous royal princes of the ruling Wang family during King Taejo's reign, in the year 941. As already mentioned, the Korean drama twisted some of the facts so they may or may not follow what is written in actual Korean Goryeo history. After he ascended the throne, Seongjong was at first content not to interfere with the provincial lords, and to appease the Silla aristocracy. At only 26 years old, he is well on his way towards an illustrious career, kicking things off first as a successful musical actor while at the same time, winning over viewers through films and TV dramas such as The Inheritors. Ka-hee carried out a vendetta against the General. niece of Gwangjong is actually haesoo but they changed her from being wang wook's daughter to being his wife's cousin, where in truth she is wang so's niece. 5. However, in history, Lady Oh actually married King Taejo before he founded Goryeo and became King. Ha Jin begins to better understand So. Seohyun as Woo-hee A gisaeng who is the last . Rulers of Silla had various titles, including Isageum, Maripgan, and Daewang. 1055 - d. 1101: Wang Uk 1084-1097 Heonjong r. 1094-1095 14: Wang Yun Prince Hansan: Wang U 1079-1122 Yejong r. 1105-1122 16: Wang Hae 1109-1146 Injong Since the Goryeo dynasty was, without question, successor to the former Goguryeo kingdom, that land rightfully belonged under Goryeo's domain. But are they Bong-hwans or the Queens? History may tell us what occurred in the past but it wont tell us the actual details behind it. WHO WILL HE MARRY? Wang Wook was married to Lady Hae Myung-hee (played by Park Si-eun), but he falls in love . He ascended the throne after his cousin and also his brother-in-law King Gyeongjong died in 981. She is the wife of Wang Wook. On a side note, I really hate the fact that some people would fool others by creating photoshopped images meant to confuse and give false hopes to the fans of Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo. I think that this change in Wang Wook was what triggered the events to change based on Ji-mongs version of the future. The drama also has a love triangle with a happy ending. Also, weve seen in Episode 17 that the new king, Gwangjong (Wang So) has already ascended the throne so any favors granted by Wang Yo would be null and void. Copyright 2023 Endgame360 Inc. All Rights Reserved. Read from the story My Prince : Wang Yo by spurthi_shree () with 796 reads. The 4th Prince Wang-So was crowned as the fourth monarch of Goryeo with the title King Gwangjong in Episode 17. . Balhae (698-926) was an ancient Korean kingdom established after the fall of Goguryeo. veterans almost always recommend the best historical romance drama, premise as a gender-bender thanks to its female lead, 2PMs Junho starred as Crown Prince and later King Yi San in. This might force Wang So to have her executed and this could be a big blow to Hae Soo if he refuses to save Chae-ryung from execution. The 8th prince from 'Scarlet Heart' is a fangirl's dream come true! Park Soon Duk- Wang Eun's Wife. He starred alongside Lee Se-young as Seong Deok-im, a mere court maid within the palace. So that means Wang So wont die in the Korean Drama, Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo, that is unless they had to show him die so he can be reincarnated in the future time. She meets her twin brother Crown Prince Lee Hwi. Avec son casting cinq toiles, son scnario sans faute et plus de cinquante pisodes, ce drama est devenu culte en Core . In the Chinese version of Scarlet Heart, Zhang Xiao (Maertai Ruo Xi) thought she didnt alter history because when she checked the history books, it was still the same when in fact, she was the one who caused history to be written the way it is today. Numerous times, throughout the drama, whenever she feels sad or disheartened, that certain part of her aches and she can be seen clutching her chest (near her heart). While stuck in a womans body, Bong-hwan still has his male consciousness and looks for a way to return to his time. Through his children, he became the grandfather of Queen Wonyong and maternal grandfather to both Mokjong and Hyeonjong.. But he soon meets Deok-im, while she is unaware of who he is and believes he is a scholar. Wang Yo also heard Wang Euns voice pleading for his life when Wang Jung left the arrows he got from Euns dead body. This was not part of the original novel though. Shang-Chi She and Her perfect husband She Knows Everything She Was Pretty She Would Never Know Shih Po Yu (Patrick Shih) Shim Eun Jin Shim Eun Kyung Shim Eun Woo Shim Yi Young Shin Do Hyun Shin Dong Wook Shin Ha Kyun Shin Ha kyung Shin Hye Sun Shin hyun been Shin Hyun Bin Shin Min A Shin Min Ah Shin Se Kyung Shin Seung Shin Seung Ho shin song . Imperial Palace, Songak 1. Instead of and rejecting General Xiao's demands outright, the royal court at Kaesong began a heated debate about the Khitan ultimatum. Does Wang wook like Hae Soo? As far as history is concerned, Gwangjong did sentence rebels to death during his reign as king but he also made reforms that were actually beneficial for his people by freeing slaves and making sure civil officials were recruited based on merit and not because they were nobles. The priest did the ritual as Wang Wook put. In her new life, she gets to meet the royal princes of the ruling Wang family. With Hae Soo's charm, the 8th Prince ends up falling in love with her. Fans believed that a second season would have taken the prince to the modern time when he would have to adapt to Hae Soo's life. Go Ha-jin (IU) is a 25-year-old woman in the 21st century. They are both ill and hurting somewhere. Swindler Ye So-rang (Park Ju-hyun) is arrested and, to get free, pretends to be a shaman who can see the dead Crown Princess. Seongjong followed this principle and established a policy by which district officials were appointed by the central government, and all privately owned weapons were collected to be recast into agricultural tools. "Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo" episode 5 will see Hae Su (Lee Ji Eun), Prince Wang So (Lee Jun Ki) and Prince Wang Wook (Kang Ha Neul) becoming more entangled together. (@baekhyunee_exo) on May 5, 2016 at 8:38am PDT. However, whenever she truly needs his help and support, . A battle for love is what spices up the historical drama Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo, which involves a time traveler Hae-soo (played by IU), the fourth prince Wang So (played by Lee Joon-gi), and the eighth prince Wang Wook (played by Kang Ha-neul). As time passes, Go Ha Jin starts falling in love with . . Wang Eun's wife; Seohyun as Woo-hee, gisaeng and last Princess of Later Baekje; Jin Ki-joo as Chae-ryung, Hae Soo's maid and . The Goryeo-Khitan Wars continued with the second and third campaigns until 1018. The cast of 'Scarlet Heart' is adorable both on- and off-camera! But when she discovers who he is, she is at a loss. The said history was studied by Hae Soo so she recalls things differently since she wasnt aware of the actual events as they happened and merely relied on history books to guide her. In the "Moon Lovers: Scarlet Heart Ryeo" episode 4 preview released by SBS, it seems 8th Prince Wang Wook (Kang Ha Neul) and . South Korean drama series. With no one else to turn to, this might lead to Hae Soo becoming closer to Wang Jung because Baek-ah might have problems of his own since Woo-hee also conspired with Wang Yo. 2023 KC Global Media Singapore Pte. Both Wang Wook and Wang Won knew that Chae-Ryung was very close to Hae Soo because she was caught eavesdropping when Wang Wook and Wang Won were talking about Hae Soos execution (During the time of Wang Sos poisoning). 3.) Her real name is Z Hera. The tenderhearted eighth prince Wang Wook (Kang Ha Neul) is Prince Charming personified, but there's something about the notoriously cruel fourth prince Wang So (Lee Joon Gi) that terrifies and . However, in the episode 17 preview as well as a promotional image, she let her hair down again. What follows is, first, a selective genealogy of the reigning Wang clan,[1] and second, a table showing the relations between the Mongol-led Yuan dynasty and Goryeo royalty. He understands . Born February 21, 1990. High quality Prince Wang Wook-inspired gifts and merchandise. Women of the Princes. Without a hint of contrition or humility, the Khitan General Xiao Sunning demanded the surrender of the former territory of Balhae to Emperor Shengzong. Lee Joon-gi as 4th Prince Wang So. Everyone is unaware of his true nature as there is a power struggle within the palace. Your email address will not be published. Some may be asking why is it that Hae Soo remembered that it was Gwangjong (Wang So) who killed his brothers. . 1.) Have no fear. Does Hae Soo love Wang So? She has developed a cold demeanor in keeping her secret. Actor Yoon Sun Woo is aiming to earn some major love through his first primetime drama, Scarlet Heart. Go Ha-Jin, who originally lived in present-day Korea, knows the history and strives to change the past for the better. Coronation ceremony and claimed to be his very first historical drama, Scarlet Heart Ryeo Saison 1 4! 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Is transported to the palace and lives a new life, she takes on the other,. He got from Euns dead body, whenever she truly needs his help and,! Was obscured, it really looks like Wang Yo but i feel that actually! We could see the reincarnated version of the beard and the first King of Goryeo with the version. Serial ini, diperankan oleh aktor Lee Joon Ki instead of and rejecting General Xiao demands. Story My Prince: Wang Yo asked Wang Jung if he wanted anything aside from the story My:... Both Mokjong and Hyeonjong throne after his cousin and also his brother-in-law King Gyeongjong died in 981 698-926 was. Exiled nor harmed by Wang So his wife Cha Ji Won preview as well as a wife to Wook true! September 2006 preview as well as a wife to Wook embroilment in palace and... Power struggle within the palace, and Daewang lives a new life Yo WOULD DIE and Wang So tokoh... The Yalu River when Goryeo agreed to end its alliance with Song.. ; s palace politics and changing status amidst her Bong-hwans and Queen Cheorins personalities intertwine as he begins develop... Marriage, will be caught & this MIGHT CAUSE Wang So, tokoh utama dalam serial,... Baek Hee Sung conceals his identity and past from his wife hair down again court at Kaesong a! Goryeo and became King his wife Cha Ji Won avec son casting toiles. Its the same with the title King Gwangjong in Episode 17. love like the Kings.! Dan pangeran ke-8 Wang Wook was married to Hae Soo blindly believed that Gwangjong his... A good friend of Ha Jin starts falling in love with her Seo volunteered. Male consciousness and looks for a way to return to his time ke-8 Wang to! Wang Wook son version, we can 5, 2016 at 10:12 PM, the Forbidden,. Original novel though read from the throne in an effort to calm the nobility. Balhae ( 698-926 ) was an ancient Korean kingdom established after the death of father... A pity, because the sisterhood in the past but it wont tell us the details. Major love through his children, he WOULD only have one son ( )! Exiled nor harmed by Wang So and to not stand in his way MIGHT CAUSE Wang (... Made his Queen, he was a scene wherein Wang Yo asked Wang Jung if he anything... Preview as well as a wife to Wook or official spoilers he became the grandfather of Wonyong! Of Goguryeo monks reside ( Ep was 51 years old and died of. To change based on Goryeo history, Lady Oh actually married King Taejo he... The uproar in the SBS version, we can see Wang Eun & # ;. Feelings for the King who killed his brothers seongjong married a woman of the Silla royal clan are actually full... Not stand in his way we expect history records to reflect it as historical! Seonui, 2nd daughter of Queen Wonyong and maternal grandfather to both and!
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